Some more commentary from the subject at hand.....
If you are anyone else truly loves a person, why would you want to leave them there?
I don't think anybody wants to leave anybody anywhere that's going to get them hurt. Unfortunately, as adults, we cannot make decisions for other people, no matter how much healthier we think our way might be. To try to make decisions for other people is a very codependent trait, and stems from a desire to control somebody else's behavior - even if you're only trying to control it because you A) love that person and/or B) know what they're doing is hurtful to themselves or others. It's an unpleasant fact, but it's nonetheless very true. I can say without question that I've spent a LOT of time doing this to people I love(d), even though I sincerely believed - with all my heart - that my motives were as pure as the wind-driven snow.
Even GOD cannot (and will not) control our decisions.
Love means you reach down a hand to pull them out. It is up to them if or not they want to take hold.
Correct. However, you cannot keep trying to get their attention and remind them how wrong they are, and once they tell you "go away", it's time for you to back off. They know where you are, and they know how to get a hold of you if they need to. It doesn't mean you love them any less, but it's the healthiest thing for you and them to do. Like I've said before, there's a difference between extending the olive branch and beating the other party with it. This situation is almost no different.
Yes, your love for them doesn't stop if they refuse.
And, oh - does that ever make it that much harder.
I don't think that she was in any form condemning you.
I don't think she was. Some of her commentary struck me as fairly judgemental, and I didn't agree with that. That was what my primary points were supposed to be about.
And I don't think that you could argue that a bar is not more sexually charged than church
How sexually charged any given situation or location is is entirely contingent on the people involved. I know if instances where - on a youth group outing - kids have sneaked off and had sex. I also know that if a guy sits behind, next two, or withing view of a really hot girl and that guy doesn't get a grip on his thoughts, he can get so worked up and turned on thinking about having sex with that girl he couldn't be more aroused at a strip bar. The times I've been the most wildly aroused I was nowhere near a bar or a club.
....is that it came across in your post (at least to me) that you were offended that your mom would question your decision.
Nah - I don't think that was her point. I think she was just trying to keep me honest. I ask myself that same question every time I suit up.
....people have to make up their minds and have an open heart in order to change. So it's not our job to drag them out of the cesspool. It's our job to show them life can be different and even better. They have to make up their mind and their heart on their own. We can't force anyone out of the sin they live in. And when we try, it makes people despise Christians even more.
Ding Ding Ding Ding Ding! Nailed it.
....we as Christians are responsible for loving people and then helping them see that The Lord loves them, and wants them to accept His salvation and follow Him.
Preach Christ always, and when necessary, use words - right?
Mahatma Ghandi said "I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ."
Man - I can't think of a better commentary on what Christians are doing wrong.
Thoughts? If you guys have anything else to say, please chime in.
For today, here's what I have.
I called in sick to the theater because if stayed home and finished the order I'd make roughly 30X what I would have made at the theater today. So I lied and told my boss I was sick. I have the comp time to cover it, I haven't taken a sick day in nearly a year, and I got my shift covered over an hour ahead of schedule, so the theater suffered no inconvenience. I don't feel good about what I did, but it seemed to be the best decision at the time. I know lying is wrong. I'm not exactly proud of it. I got the order shipped, though freight to Malaysia ain't cheap.
Tonight we took our daughter to Twisted Root Burger Company in Roanoke. Good burgers, albeit a bit pricey. Brian met us there - 'tis always good to see tha' Chief. It makes me miss playing paintball, or at least shooting guns of some kind. I've been debating tinkering with my shotgun by changing the heat shield, the stock, and adding a rail and a red-dot optic on top to make accurate zombie-whacking a bit easier, at least until I can start my M-4 build. For what it's worth, I was much worse when it came to paintball guns - I could accessorize those like Barbie dolls.
Timone is crunching on a styrofoam peanut.
Nothing much really going on the heart level, which makes these kind of dull some days. No real angst, though I did get a touch of the old stuff for a moment yesterday. I was listening to music and I heard a song that took me way back, enough so that I had to change the music before it was over. Funny how effective music can be, huh?
I tended to get more interesting material when I was in real anguish, I think. Not that that's a dare or anything - just an observation.
That's all I have for tonight. Thank all y'all for posting :-)
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8 comments:
You Christians, are so unlike your Christ. Yes, because he is Deity and we are not. I happen to know several Christians who at this very moment are gathering up medical supplies, water, food, bedding and a lot of other things to drive four hours to deliver them to a medical compound that has been destroyed, Yes, I know non Christians would do the same.
"It makes people despise Christians even more" Christians have always been despised, always will be. But when Christians despise each other that is another matter and that happens a lot sadly.
Was I being judgmental? Hell, yes, I'm gonna always be, so are you, so is everyone else. Face it.
(SD cowgirl, my remarks were for Ian alone but thanks for you input) And Steven you are right on. I knew my remarks would hurt, so I take my apology back. If Ian wants to forgive, he can, if not I can live that decision. But since we are all being so da.. self righteous maybe there is room for forgiveness somewhere in there. I'm still working on the forgiveness thing.
OK Ian, it is obvious, I cannot deal with your blogs in a sane manner, so for a while I think I just better read something else. Not that I need to tell you, but you are free to live your life as you please it's your life not mine. Yes you have made choices that brought much pain. So will your own daughter. But I think it is time, I take my bow and make my exit. Frankly I am just too weary and tired. Haiti is stressful under normal conditions but now it is anybody's guess what will happen next.
Besides I am just way too old for this sort of thing.
I thought that part of being a Christian is learning NOT to be judgemental, because while we see people's actions, we don't see their hearts. I'm confused. That is one of the reasons that I think people believe what Ghandi said- because it's evidenced by how Christians often treat people in Sin.
I'm well aware the comments were directed to Ian, but I'm also aware, that he has different life experiences than you, and that even in his sin, it can be used to help others and maybe even glorify Christ.
Many times it is convenient to say Christians are being judgemental.. but are we supposed to help one another when we see them making choices that are not bringing glory to God? Isn't that our purpose as Christians to live to bring Glory to God?? To better his kingdom.. If I am making worldly choices and I CONFESS to loving Christ, then we are held to a different standard, correct?? So putting ourselves in various situations that we know are not the best and then wondering why other Christians that love us are questioning our actions is not ok. We all have people that love us, THANKFULLY! When I have had a friend come along and ask me about my behavior or question it, FOR ME, I have found if I get defensive or say they are being judgemental it is because I am guilty as charged and not living to the standard that I am held.
John 4
Jesus and the Woman of Samaria
7 A woman from Samaria came to draw water. Jesus said to her, "Give me a drink." 8 (For his disciples had gone away into the city to buy food.) 9 The Samaritan woman said to him, "How is it that you, a Jew, ask for a drink from me, a woman of Samaria?" (For Jews have no dealings with Samaritans.) 10 Jesus answered her, "If you knew the gift of God, and who it is that is saying to you, 'Give me a drink,' you would have asked him, and he would have given you living water." 11 The woman said to him, "Sir, you have nothing to draw water with, and the well is deep. Where do you get that living water? 12 Are you greater than our father Jacob? He gave us the well and drank from it himself, as did his sons and his livestock." Jesus said to her, "Everyone who drinks of this water will be thirsty again, 14 but whoever drinks of the water that I will give him will never be thirsty again. The water that I will give him will become in him a spring of water welling up to eternal life." 15 The woman said to him, "Sir, give me this water, so that I will not be thirsty or have to come here to draw water."
16 Jesus said to her, "Go, call your husband, and come here." 17 The woman answered him, "I have no husband." Jesus said to her, "You are right in saying, 'I have no husband'; 18 for you have had five husbands, and the one you now have is not your husband. What you have said is true." 19 The woman said to him, "Sir, I perceive that you are a prophet. 20 Our fathers worshiped on this mountain, but you say that in Jerusalem is the place where people ought to worship." 21 Jesus said to her, "Woman, believe me, the hour is coming when neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem will you worship the Father. 22 You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews. 23 But the hour is coming, and is now here, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for the Father is seeking such people to worship him. 24 God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth." 25 The woman said to him, "I know that Messiah is coming (he who is called Christ). When he comes, he will tell us all things." 26 Jesus said to her, "I who speak to you am he."
27 Just then his disciples came back. They marveled that he was talking with a woman, but no one said, "What do you seek?" or, "Why are you talking with her?" 28 So the woman left her water jar and went away into town and said to the people, 29 "Come, see a man who told me all that I ever did. Can this be the Christ?" 30 They went out of the town and were coming to him.
What did Jesus do? What did He show her and share with her? Ian, what you say makes sense but what your mom is saying makes sense as well. Both are what we should do. We have this amazing news and love to share with others and why would we not? Some may need to be shown it, some may need to hear it, some may need both at certain times. There is no easy answer or reaction. Everyone and every relationship is different. The most important thing is that we follow God. He tells us to spread the Good News, so why would we not? Are we too worried about the other persons feeling or reactions? But then the question is...What about God? Who should we be more worried about, what others think or God?
SD Cowgirl,
We are not suppose to be judgmental but we are not suppose to be and do many things that we all do. The fact that she knows that she is judgmental and knows that she will always is being real. I mean, think about it? Are you not judging her right now? By your reaction and comments it comes across that way. We are not perfect and can not be but THANK GOD for His Grace that we are saved and cleaned, even though we sin daily.
sidenote...word verification was "unlike" haha
“Isn't that our purpose as Christians to live to bring Glory to God?? To better his kingdom...”
I thought Jesus said the two most important things were to love God and love one another as we love ourselves. I can’t, off the top of my head, name ANY Christian who comes even remotely close to that. I certainly don’t “love everyone”. I bet Mother Teresa even had some people she despised.
Kind of difficult to (honestly) love people like Hitler, or Child Molesters, or Mimes. And that list could go on and on.
When I get to heaven, if they ask me “Did you love others as you loved yourself?”
I’ll answer honestly and say “Nope, not even close”.
When they ask why I didn’t, I’ll say: “Why’d you have to make Humanity suck?”
And anyway, anything I could do to “bring Glory to God” would be pathetically insignificant and infinitesimal to the Glory you see everywhere you look in CREATION every day. About like spitting in the ocean.
I can’t out-Glory The Universe.
It is meaningless to “add +1 to Infinity”.
Instead, I think we’re all here to EXPERIENCE the Glory of God. That is the only reason for existence that makes any sense to me at all. But instead of doing that, MOST of Humanity is wrapped up in itself rather than seeing past their own noses.
And what does this have to do with the Blog and comments? Hell, I don’t know. I just started typing and this is the garbage that spewed out.
Your mom, it seems to me, was just doing as God commanded in the bible. Seeing her brother... she went in a spirit of meekness, etc. Instructions from God. She did it in love and rather than bash her for it, shouldn't you thank her for loving you enough to share? Is she perfect? no. Are you? absolutely not. But when you have people who love you enough to say the things that you could need to hear, even when they know it could make you mad at them, that's a beautiful thing. Same as when you tell your daughter things that she doesn't want to hear, but you say because you love her. Seems something to be thankful for and protective of, imo.
There are also verses about being easily offended.
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